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Thread: About that lateral

  1. #11
    Elite Member Mad Dog's Avatar
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    It looked like a lateral in real time and on the replay they threw up on the video board. It was tossed backwards but forward momentum of Russ caused it to go forward, like tossing a ball out of a moving car. You may toss it backwards but it’s going to go forwards in the end.
    I don’t blame anyone for not doubting. No one in the stadium did.

    Sadly NFL rules don’t take into physics. Hence all the bad fines for illegal hits that actually were in the chest.

    But media types always have to come up with some anti-Seahawk angle. The music city miracle was far more of a forward pass.

  2. #12
    Elite Member Stinkeye's Avatar
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    [QUOTE=Halftime;8195]I think the non-challenge was fallout from the blown challenge and wasted time out early on the 4th and inches call. If they still had a timeout and challenge, I bet they would have challenged. One mistake begets another, fortunately to our benefit here.

    Yes, their coach said as much in post game interview. He said he couldn't see it too well and didn't want to cost them another timeout. Probably a good thing that the Hawks lined up quickly and snapped it to rule out a last second red flag.

  3. #13
    Registered Member DoorninkFan's Avatar
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    Exactly like I was saying!

    Wrote Tyson: "FYI: The lateral that @DangeRussWilson threw to @MikeDavisRB in Sunday’s @Seahawks @Eagles game was a legit "Galilean Transformation." In their reference frame, the ball went backwards. It's not their fault they ran forward faster than the ball.”

    In other words, if the ball appeared to go forward — as the Eagles protested, and which would be illegal since Wilson was six yards beyond the line of scrimmage at the time — it was just science at work and not a punishable offense.

    The Encyclopedia Britannica defines a Galilean transformation as "a set of equations in classical physics that relate the space and time coordinates of two systems moving at a constant velocity relative to each other. Adequate to describe phenomena at speeds much smaller than the speed of light, Galilean transformations formally express the ideas that space and time are absolute; that length, time, and mass are independent of the relative motion of the observer; and that the speed of light depends upon the relative motion of the observer."
    https://www.seattletimes.com/sports/seahawks/neil-degrasse-tyson-responds-says-seahawks-lateral-was-just-the-galilean-transformation



  4. #14
    Registered Member Halftime's Avatar
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    Well, okay fine, but.....
    On the gridiron, it is known as the frame of REFerence. i.e. it is the ref's frame of reference that matters.

  5. #15
    Registered Member mattj20's Avatar
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    ok...I had to pull open my Physics book from college because i'd either forgotten Galilean transformation or it just didn't register. Galilean transformation is different (slightly) than the Lorentz transformation, which i'd rather use and is valid up to light speed. Galilean is x' = x - vt, t' = t. t=t'=0 (or we can accept that). It appears to not - but that is because of our relative position. To show it more clearly - look at the link below. They run through the clip of the lateral several times and the very last time you can see it clearly. Russell throws the pass backwards BUT he throws it from his chest (x). Davis catches it high over his head and behind his back (slightly). Had Davis caught the ball at his chest at the same position (x') as Russell had thrown it (relative to position) - we all could have very clearly seen that it was a backwards pass because Davis would have been behind the yard line marker that Russell was at. It doesn't seem that way because of relativity. Davis is simply moving faster than the ball! Still a backwards pass.

    http://www.seahawks.com/news/2017/12...ahawks-lateral

    Someone out there check my numbers but I believe that may be it. Neil is the man - for sure, damn!!!

  6. #16


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    Simply put, RW didn't throw it backward at the same rate of speed as he was running forward, therefore the ball continues in that direction, but at a lower speed, thus giving the appearance of being a backwards pass while the ball is actually moving forward in real space.

    Vernacular...it's all relative...

  7. #17


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    I found that this helped me wrap my brain about the lateral.

  8. #18


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    Good find

  9. #19
    Registered Member mattj20's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MigratingOsprey View Post
    Good find
    Agree - this is good! We are all saying the same thing really, just in different ways. And apologize for going on and on with this topic. This will be my final post on it, I promise. I find stuff like this fascinating. Imagine if you will that Russell was moving at 20 mph vertically down the field and threw the ball backwards and he was able to come to a complete dead stop (physically impossible) a split second after tossing the ball. Well, the ball is still moving at 20 mph vertically down the field and would be caught say - 5 to 10 yards in front of where Russell is at that time! Everyone would be like, what the hell!??! Bill's clip shows an illustration of that very well...thanks for sharing it.

  10. #20


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    The throwing the ball over your head to a guy behind you and having the ball caught in advance of where it was thrown definitely puts a twist on forward pass

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